Z-Wave, Xanura (and others), KAKU (and others)

Post by **Alexander** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 7:12 pm

Different technologies, but i want to 'hear' which you will choose today.

I'm using some Xanura modules, but i'm disappointed in the fact that if noise is on the power line, you can have 'big' problems. I've two modules in the living room and a Philip WakeUp light in my bedroom. Installed a filter last week, but i still have problems with receiving the signal from my HS server. It's the same with hitting the buttons myself, I've a 50%/50% change (or even less) that the signal is received by HS. The same in my toilet. Use MS13E to send a motion sensor to RFXcom receiver. That works perfectly, but the signal from HS to the Xanura device doesn't get through (more often) or the signal from the Xanura device to HS. The effect is that if someone is leaving the toilet and presses the switch to turn of the light, the light will go on after a few seconds, because the motion detector did detect motion. I've I look in the log file, the signal from the Xanura device to HS, hasn't been seen (which will activate a event to discard 20 seconds of motion).

Now, i can try to filter the noise somewhere else, but adding another device (for instance a vacuum cleaner) can hit me with the same problems.

One interesting part is, many talk about the bi-directional signal for the Xanura products is a big plus. I will not argue with that, but i doubt the usefulness of this, because HomeSeer doesn't check if the signal is received by a Xanura device. It will update the status if i press the button connected to the Xanura device. That is the bi-directional functionality we are all talking about, but this can also be done by using for instance a KAKU mini receiver and a KAKU wall switch. With HS you can check the status from the Xanura devices, but who does use this functionality (and not trust the status of HS devices in the home page)?

So why not using KAKU or Z-Wave instead of Xanura? What is better, KAKU or Z-Wave and why?

Post by **Esteban** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 7:45 pm

Hehe, I'll be the 'eiselganger' on the forum that holds the Z-Wave fort.

As far as your question about which is better regarding KAKU vs Z-Wave off the top of my head:

Z-Wave
Pros:
-Reliable
-Polling of devices
-Quick response
-No wires
-No filters necessary
-Mesh network

Cons:
-EU devices are really slow coming out
-No micromodule available still
-No wires

KAKU
Pros:
-Cheap
-A great variety of devices available
-No wires
-Cheap
-No filters necessary

Cons:
-Not as reliable as other technologies
-No '2-way'
-Functions on crowded band
-No wires

I'll leave it to my fellow Xanura domoticians on the forum to give you the Xanura vs Wireless-tech arguments.

Post by **Alexander** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 8:25 pm

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Esteban
Cons:
-EU devices are really slow coming out
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
What devices are you missing?

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
-No micromodule available still
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

http://www.smarthus.info/product_info.p ... ts_id=2130
Handleiding is zelfs nederlands: http://www.smarthus.info/support/manual ... 506004.pdf moet toch wat te vinden zijn dan.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
-No wires
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

It's a con?

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
-Not as reliable as other technologies
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Is it based on a fealing or facts?

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
-Functions on crowded band
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Technically could be a problem, but is this also the experience?

Post by **Esteban** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:35 am

Hi Mgizmo,

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">EU devices are really slow coming out
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
What devices are you missing?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I've been using Z-Wave for the last 2/2.5years, believe me the wait for anything else than an Appliance- or light-module has been looooong [;)] But my comment was more regarding Z-Wave+HS use. What I'm missing is Z-Wave thermostats that work with HS.

Although a lot of Z-Wave stuff has come out lately, not everything works in combination with Homeseer.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
http://www.smarthus.info/product_info.p ... ts_id=2130
Handleiding is zelfs nederlands: http://www.smarthus.info/support/manual ... 506004.pdf moet toch wat te vinden zijn dan.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Thanks, I know about this module http://www.smarthus.info/product_info.p ... ts_id=2130 but so far have heard inconsistent reports on weither it works with HS or not... If you have a definitive answer let me know

But it's still not what I'm really looking for, as there is no option to connect the lightswitch itself to it. I'm looking for a micromodule with connections for the lamp and connections for the switch.

The manual link http://www.smarthus.info/support/manual ... 506004.pdf is something different. That is a Z-Wave 'remote' with 4 button inputs that you can build into something. It doesn't switch any power load. I think you mean this one: http://www.smarthus.info/redirect.php?a ... 507001.pdf

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
-No wires
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

It's a con?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
It's both.

Wired solutions (C-bus etc) are less prone to inteference etc and can react quicker. But wired solutions require you to open all the walls and pull cables all over the house...

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
-Not as reliable as other technologies
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Is it based on a fealing or facts?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
It's based on fact as it's not 2way so you can't be sure if something is ON or OFF -> less reliable. That being said generally KAKU can give a decent setup. Lots of people use it and are pretty satisfied with it as far as I can tell from the forum. Especially for the price...

In theory it also depends on where you live and how many neighbours you have that use KAKU too etc. With Z-Wave your neighbour will never interact with your devices by accident as every device is unique and 'paired' with only your own Z-Wave mesh network. But in practice, the chances of this being a problem are pretty small.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
-Functions on crowded band
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Technically could be a problem, but is this also the experience?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Only technically. From experience this has not been a problem. But you should ask somebody that runs a lot of KAKU. My own experiences with KAKU have been good but limited.

Ciao,
Esteban

Post by **elektrovakman** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:44 pm

Wenn you like wireless RF solutions look at the Xcomfort system of Moeller : see www.draadloosschakelen.nl

Very reliable and easy to use. I have used it bij myself and i am very enthousiastic about the system.

Wenn you have questions about it please ask...